The Crackin' Backs Podcast

What “They” don’t want you to learn about YOUR heart health! - Dr. Jack Wolfson, Cardiologist

• Dr. Terry Weyman and Dr. Spencer Baron

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In this episode, we're discussing the world of cardiology with none other than Dr. Jack Wolfson, a trailblazer in the field of naturopathic cardiology. Dr. Wolfson challenges the status quo by emphasizing a holistic approach to heart health, focusing on treating the whole body rather than just isolated issues. But how does he navigate the turbulent waters of conventional medicine when his peers may not see eye-to-eye with his methods?

Join us as we explore Dr. Wolfson's innovative approach to addressing genetic predispositions to heart diseases. Discover how natural interventions can potentially alter gene expression, shifting the focus from managing consequences to proactive prevention. But that's not all – Dr. Wolfson weighs in on the controversial debate surrounding the impact of the 2020 Virus and mRNA vaccines on heart tissue, offering his professional opinion on this pressing issue.

As we delve deeper, we uncover the role of biomarkers like oxidized LDL and TMAO in cardiovascular diseases, and Dr. Wolfson shares his insights on the efficacy of natural interventions compared to traditional medications.

Later in the show, Dr. Wolfson breaks down the truth behind various heart health supplements, from Omega-3s to CoQ10, revealing which ones are truly effective and which may be overrated. And when it comes to dietary advice, he tackles controversial topics head-on, discussing the impact of animal-based foods, plant-based diets, Paleo vs. Keto, and more.

We even explore the age-old question: to drink or not to drink? Dr. Wolfson shares insights on alcohol consumption and its effects on cardiovascular health, shedding light on the tipping point between moderation and risk.

From atrial fibrillation to common misconceptions about cholesterol and statins, Dr. Wolfson leaves no stone unturned. Join us as we uncover the truth behind invasive procedures like stents and bypass surgery, and discover alternative approaches to managing heart health.

Get ready to challenge your beliefs and revolutionize your approach to heart health with Dr. Jack Wolfson, only on the Crackin Backs podcast!

 

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Join us as we talk to some of the greatest minds and discover some of the most incredible gems you can use to maintain a higher level of health. Crackin Backs Podcast

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Get ready to have your beliefs shaken as Dr. Jack Wilson, the maverick of cardiology, spills the beans on navigating the stormy seas of holistic healing and a conventional world from debunking myths about genetic predispositions to heart disease, to tackling the hot button debate on the impact of the 2020 virus and vaccines on Heart Health, Dr. Wolfson fearlessly dives into the heart of the matter. Discover groundbreaking insights on managing cardiovascular biomarkers, integrating exercise for vascular health and unraveling mysteries behind supplements and diets. Strap in for an electrifying ride as we challenge conventional wisdom and unlock the secrets to a healthier heart. Tune in now.

Dr. Terry Weyman:

We're super excited to have the world famous cardiologist Jack Wilson on this show. And I can't wait to talk about longevity hearts. But what's cool is you're known as a holistic cardiologist, which does for the I have heard that term until Dr. Spencer kind of told me about Yes, so welcome to the show.

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

No, thanks so much, guys. I appreciate being on and you know, cardiovascular disease number one killer worldwide. So clearly, the mainstream medical model is not working on this one, we got to fix it.

Dr. Terry Weyman:

You just kick it right out of the boat. I love that. And you know, for a long time, holistic medicine was actually an MD term because they the guy with the black bag would come to your house and take care of the whole body. And then it kind of became an alternative term, holistic medicine and and you kind of look at the whole body rather just than just heart related issues. As a cardiologist, how do you navigate the challenges when conventional peers may not see eye to eye with your thought process?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Yeah, I think you know, just kind of taking it to the people really, I don't really care what the other medical doctors think about me, but I care about what patients and people think about me. And so you bring the truth out there. And when most people get the truth, they hear this version of the story, it makes common sense to them. They don't want to be on pharmaceuticals, they don't want to be like their parents, their grandparents, who took a whole bevy of prescriptions, and constantly at the medical doctor, and then the last five to 10 years of their life or just sick, they weren't doing anything that they wanted to do. And then ultimately, a lot of these people wind up in an intensive care unit for the last few months, and then they die. And people don't want that and they want better solutions. And I think that's what one fantastic thing about the internet is, is that it gives people that kind of freedom to look for that information. Because if it was, you know, 3040 years ago, all you really knew was the doctors way or the highway. And here now we've got a lot of different possibilities. So there are a lot of other holistic alternative natural practitioners that are kind of popping up. I'm certainly a big fan of chiropractic, I always kind of say, Hey, listen, you know, Chiropractors should be the primary care providers, you know, chiropractors, let them be the gatekeepers of all things, health and wellness. And then if someone needs medical therapy, or they need a specialist, like a cardiologist or a lung specialist, you know, or a general internal medicine doctor, if they're kind of struggling, even under chiropractic care and this kind of chiropractic, lifestyle methodology, you know, then there's a time and a place for the modern medicine emergency Doc's,

Dr. Spencer Baron:

all hail to Dr. Jack Wilson. Before I get into asking you about genetic predispositions and how you handle that, and how you handle consequences, I do want to ask you how it all started, like, what was that moment when you went? Hey, what I just learned in school ain't working, or it's not. It's not what I want to do. What was that moment? Do you remember?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Yeah, so I don't tell chiropractic because my wife who is a chiropractor is in the room over my shoulder and making sure that I say it, I told him, Because chiropractic truly changed my life, not from the chiropractic adjustment for me personally, although, of course, has been very beneficial, you know, to me, but chiropractic, the methodology and the mindset. And the philosophy is what pulled me out of the medical matrix. So when I met my wife in 2005, my father who was a cardiologist, he was my idol. He was my hero. I followed exactly in his footsteps. I finish off my training in Chicago, I move out to Arizona join a big group. I'm doing amazing. Life is wonderful. And my father is sick and dying of a Parkinson's like illness. And Mayo Clinic had no idea why my father is sick and dying. And I meet this 29 year old doctor of chiropractic and she tells me Exactly why my father was sick and dying. And she said, if you want to avoid the same fate because you're doing the same things that he was doing, you will change your life. And you'll change your practice, you need to become a DC and I said, Wait a second, you want me to become a doctor of chiropractic, after 10 years of medical training to become a cardiologist. She said, No, not a DC doctor of chiropractic, you need to become a DC doctor of cause. And that's what I did, I would eventually quit the mainstream medical group start natural heart doctor in 2012. And the rest is, is history. And it's, it's really been fantastic in the sense that I clearly know all of the problems in mainstream medicine. And then now on this holistic natural side, learning all the solutions, it's really been incredible.

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Dr. Spencer Baron:

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Dr. Spencer Baron:

Cause so let's take a typical patient that might come in to your office, maybe someone who's worried about their future because of familial habits and our familial traits or, you know, genetic predispositions. But how would you handle someone that's asymptomatic? And then how would you handle someone that has been experiencing consequences of heart disease?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

So to answer your question, Dr. Spencer, to the best of my ability, I guess I would say this, our genetics are perfect. Our genetics are perfect. However, we got here call that created in the image of God, evolution, God created evolution, however we got here and our genetics are perfect. We can run and jump and see and feel I mean, Spencer, take a look at the you know, the professional athletes that you've worked with over the years, like these are genetic marvels. What with what these people can do, and all of us in general, I mean, we can do all of these things. We can make babies, we enable our genetics, why would we be genetically programmed to have a heart attack, a stroke, cancer, dementia, we're not genetically programmed for any of that. And as you guys know, back in the 1990s, it was all about the human genome project, we're going to study the human genome, and they did it. They studied the human genome. And what they found out was it's not genetics, it's all epigenetics, the way that nutrition and the environment and your lifestyle influenced your genes. So therefore, some families may have this family history of heart disease, or cancer, for dementia, some families have all the above. But it's all the way that we interact with those genes, is really what it is we are not genetically programmed to develop any of those things. It's all from what I would say, violations of the concept of eat well live well think, well, that's what causes gene genetics. Now, the medical doctors like to say genetics, because then that takes the onus off the person, like there's nothing you can do except for take our pharmaceuticals. There's nothing you can do about your genetics and your family history. So therefore, this surgery are this pill. And it's a it's a failed approach. That's

Dr. Spencer Baron:

beautiful. So what would you typically do when a patient comes in? Do you do lab work? Do you? Obviously you consult with them? What's your usual protocol?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Yeah, you know, what we do is and I guess what's great about it, too, is that whatever condition somebody comes in with, when you view it under the lens of what we call the 100 year heart method, which is built through the eat well live wellthank Well, which are all equally as important, by the way, test don't guess so using the most advanced testing in the world to check. Excuse me. Just a quick caveat. I never ordered CT scans on people I don't do CT, coronary calcium scan or CT angiogram, sign up Order that. And then we get into evidence based supplements and then what we call biohacking strategies, which you guys are obviously familiar with. And that could be sauna, red light therapy peptides, methylene, blue IVs, you know of which, you know, I was recently speaking at the American Academy of anti aging, and there's 700 vendors in that room, and there's a gazillion different biohacking devices, but it really we got to focus on that foundation. First, as you guys know, eat well live well think well, so whatever the condition is high blood pressure, coronary disease, atrial fibrillation. Even if someone asked me my opinion about cancer, and you know, or brain based diseases, it would always be going back to, hey, let's look at that foundation eat well, and well think well, and of course inside of living well, is always being under chiropractic care.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Just a question. I'm sure the listeners or viewers are wondering why you would never order or not order a CT.

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

So whenever you order a test, you want to know, will the results change your plan. So if someone has a coronary calcium score of zero, my plan would still be the same. You will live well thank well test, don't guess evidence based supplements biohacking strategies. If someone had the worst calcium scan in the world, my plan would still be the same. One, we could say, Okay, if my score is a zero or very low, then I will not take a statin drug. If someone says, If my score is elevated, then I will take a statin drug, and I'm fine with that approach for other if that's why somebody would do that particular test. I never write for statin drugs. I've not written a statin drug prescription in over 10 years. So for me, I would never know. So that doesn't really help me at all in that scenario. Now, what if someone has the worst disease? What happens is is that the medical doctors have learned that the coronary calcium scan is what they call a loss leader in the business world, right? So you do the scan, you find coronary calcium, now you can label that person as coronary artery disease. Now you have an indication to do a stress test and that's where the money is made a nuclear stress test. So ultimately, here's what happens with the asymptomatic person. The person who has no symptoms. Yeah. 53 year old guy. coronary CT scan, elevated calcium stress test. Yeah, a little bit abnormal. Let's do an angiogram angiogram is done. Yeah, there's some questionable blockages, and they put it in a couple stents. What they've done to the person is harm them. They haven't prevented a heart attack. They haven't saved their life. They haven't improved their symptoms because the person never had symptoms. This is a person who has been instrumented by the system. And this goes on guys, as you know, every single day I've consulted with people from all over the world. And it's a moneymaker it is all a moneymaker. And it's it's a problem. Now of course, CT scans are radiation that cause heart disease, cancer and dementia. So I don't order that test. There's a time and a place for CTE and emergency situations. Some times it does call for that test, but as far as routine screening for coronary artery calcification, totally worthless.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

This guy all right, I'm gonna I'm gonna switch gears a little bit I'm going to ask you about you know, there's a lot of hype that after the the COVID vaccines and all the myocarditis and other cardio issues that I don't know if you're aware, me being in Florida are our director of medicine for works with the governor and all that he has been so outspoken on not doing these vaccines on a routine basis, because of what research he's done and found. What are your thoughts about

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

people that um, wow, where do we start with this? You know, Dr. Spencer, I can only say this. I think that the shot is poison. I think potentially it was deliberately a poison. I think that best case scenario, it was totally rushed to market and with With no evidence of safety, no evidence of efficacy. In fact, the original data that came out in September of 2020, and actually and data in 2021, New England Journal of Medicine in those studies showed those people who got the shot versus those who didn't. Zero lives were saved in those randomized, double blind placebo controlled trials that were reported in New England Journal of Medicine. So there is no evidence according to randomized, double blind now, of course, there's all kinds of propaganda with the media and stuff like that. So I think ultimately, always believe in, you know, follow the money. This is pure pharmaceutical cartel took over this, trillions of dollars of spent lives lost because of the government actions on this. jobs, lost suicides. And obviously, ultimately, to answer your question, I saw a ton of cases of myocarditis sudden cardiac death. This was interesting because this was a case that involved a chiropractor. 79 year old chiropractor came up to me after I was speaking at an event. And he tells me the story, that he's got ischemic cardiomyopathy, he's had a couple of heart attacks. And because of that, he has an implanted defibrillator, a shock box, if his heart were to stop, he gets shot. He's never had a problem before, but they said okay, prophylactically for primary prevention, we're going to insert it 11 months go by, he never has an event. Then three days after one COVID shots in January of 2021. He goes into cardiac arrest, ventricular fibrillation, that device saves his life. And he then speaks to the cardiologist about and said, was there any relation to the shot and the cardiologist said no, 11 months, never an issue. Three days later, device goes off. One of my best friends in the world from medical school, very successful hematologist, oncologist cancer doctor at a prestigious institution in in New Jersey, gets the shots Bell's Palsy. So ultimately, I've seen a lot of cases of destruction. This, I think, was the mat the biggest insult to the world that they could have ever perpetrated. And, you know, yeah, we can talk about this forever. But it's it's sad. It's sad what they did and sad what they're capable of doing. And I guess I would want everybody just be careful for for part two, because part two will either be another alleged virus, it'll be a power, you know, an energy crisis. It'll be another banking, currency inflationary crisis. And obviously, it's the military crisis, but they're all taking their turn fleecing the little guys like us. And the more you wake up to that fact, the better off you're gonna be. Listen, health, I don't have to tell you guys you guys are chiropractors, you guys understand this? You know, this whole thing about giving the body what it needs, take away what it doesn't. That's the strategy. People who were at risk of COVID of getting sick from COVID. It was all the people that are they see doctors, they see medical doctors, and then you look at these frauds like Gavin Newsom. Right, so the governor of California, he's going out for he's going to French Laundry, he's going to these $1,000 You know, a person meals like Dr. Spencer Baron goes and he gets these expensive wines, you know, so that's what you know, that's what Gavin Newsom is doing. And Fauci, Fauci that scumbag that he is. It was insane. I listened to a podcast with Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. and the interviewer Lex Friedman. It's a wonderful podcast. And Friedman says the Kennedys Can you say anything nice about Fauci and Kennedy says no, and this is like one of the nicest, kindest guys in the entire world Kennedy. From what I can tell, yeah, he's not I mean, again, I don't because I'm my best friend. But he said he says he's got nothing to say about Fauci, Fauci is pictured at a Washington Nationals game. He's got his mask on his chin, they laugh at the rest of us. And then there's stories like this all over the place. Who is it? You know, it was she was down in your state party and right, that AOC she was down in Florida. She was partying down there. You know, it's it's, it's a people I mean, how do they not wake up to this right? How do they not wake up to this propaganda thing? How did Trump knots Trump knew was BS from the beginning, and then somehow he caved in to the pressure and I don't know maybe they put a gun to his head into his family's head or however the powers that be, you know, with all of the government would never do that, right. Yeah, the government would never do something like that the CIA would never you know, would never kill Bobby Kennedy would never change governments around the world. People wake up to this propaganda and then they got in mind for you know, for this. And, and we've learned since then the whole thing was yeah, it was just it was a sham. So

Dr. Terry Weyman:

I play devil's advocate and facility people. And I've got to say, you know, we've had some, we've had some chiropractors on the show, we've had some cardiologists, us on the show, that would say, well, the virus actually weakened the heart. And the virus is actually weaken the the mild car cardio around the heart, and that made it more susceptible of myocarditis. And what's your answer to that?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

So, whatever, whatever people, I mean, again, there's a lot of there's a whole spectrum to this conversation. As far as what, you know, work, how many people were actually getting sick? What were they getting sick from? And then did you know said, vaccine or shot actually do anything? And I think ultimately, that there clearly is many, many, many cases in the medical literature of injury from the shots. There are cases allegedly of injury from said virus. So I think what we need to really do is to continue to preach freedom, if you want to go ahead and inject yourself with an experimental poison, that's up to you. And if I don't want to, well, that's me. That's my freedom. That's my god given rights that is in the Bill of Rights. This is this is my freedom, to not get this experimental poison. So I think ultimately, the freedom to have the conversations, the freedom to have these questions, and the freedom of choice over our healthcare is always going to be paramount. But you know, the the whole time what the focus needs to be really is that how the people who allegedly were sick with COVID, they're all people with comorbidities. And there's always comorbidities now some people, right, and we've heard the stories I'll hear was this guy, he's a 55 year old chiropractor. He was in great shape, you know? And then he fell and he got sick, and he was this and this and this. There's stories like that all over. But how do I know they were healthy? What does that mean? Their health? I don't know how they ate for sure. I don't know what their you know, how they slept? Did they go to sleep on time? Do they awake on time? There was a recent study that came out a few weeks ago, that showed that if you are a night owl, if you're someone who goes to bed, they call that evening? Yes, if you go to sleep late, you have double the risk of coronary artery calcification, a test I don't like but nonetheless, people were double the risk, it is a problem. I'm not saying it's a meaningless thing to have, it definitely is a sign that you're in trouble. So when we take the history on someone, how do they sleep? How do they eat out? Are they physically active? What is their environment? Like? Do they live in a poisonous up, you know, mold? Bacteria water damaged home? Are they surrounded by EMF? Other you know, glyphosate other toxins? Are they under chiropractic care? What are their thought processes? Like? stress, anger, fear, anxiety, depression? Are they happy people? So again, whenever these people got sick, it's comorbidities. And let's focus on how do you keep a population healthy, it's not Hey, hunker down inside, afraid, and then wait for us, we're gonna come up with a vaccine to save you. And then the craziest thing, right is that the whole thing was, hey, listen, you know, your shop protects me, and my shop protects you. When it turns out, it doesn't do that. If it did anything, it would protect the individual. So again, there's no reason to force everyone in society to get it. That was a failed strategy as well.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Along with the six feet of distancing everybody else

Dr. Terry Weyman:

till they get on a plane.

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Social isolation is one of the biggest risk factors truly for who lives longer people who say that they are socially isolated, they don't have family friends, they're not part of a church group or synagogue or something like that. They die quickly. And what did COVID do? It? Isolated everyone. It puts everyone on edge about everyone else, six feet apart. I don't have to tell you guys about the power of connection. Right? I mean, you know, you guys, you see your patients, you give them a hug, they hug you. We go out, we go to health, you know, related conferences, or even chiropractic events. I'm hugging everybody. Everybody's hugging me. It's a big hug fest. It's phenomenal. And we rely on that our ancestors were tribal beings. Right, we need that tribal mentality. And they took that away from us. And okay, did they know that they were causing that kind of harm? Or was it truly something more sinister? And I can only say, Listen, I hate to sound conspiratorial. But sometimes these conspiracy theories they're coming true question everything that's for sure. But ultimately, you know, there the world is full of evil people in the history of the world. And don't be surprised if they're pulling the strings on this one.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

So, I want to ask you, sorry, my dog's making noise over here. She decided to chew on it on a toy. It's very loud. So let me ask you about, you know, your typical biomarkers like LDLs, and the TMA owes the trimethylene. And oxides, you know, what would you do? Maybe that's redundant question with with testing, but what would you do compared to traditional medication for something like that?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Yeah, so inside of our test, don't guess methodology is the markers of inflammation and oxidative stress, those are the most important markers. So if you have evidence of oxidative stress where your body is rusting, for example, you have an excess of free radicals. Compared to antioxidants, because those should be imbalanced. Everything should be imbalanced, there are things that cause oxidation in the body, totally normal. There's things that are antioxidants that the body makes, and we can also consume externally. So we want a good balance of those. But if we have high levels of oxidative stress that can be Myeloperoxidase. That can be oxidized LDL, that could be T Mao, these are all markers. But the question is what leads to those abnormal markers, a lot of the T Mao stuff was all based on hey, if you eat a lot of seafood, you're going to have really high TMDL if you eat a lot of red meat and eggs, you're going to have very high you know tml when you have to look at the the other factors that go into the those those studies and those people. Seafood to me is the healthiest food in the planet. People with the highest levels of omega three fatty acids in their blood have the lowest risk of everything, including COVID. You get that from eating seafood. So I could care less. So if someone's T Mao is elevated, there's a reason why and it's not from seafood consumption. So again, there's a lot of different problems with the studies related to to Mao condemning meat to Mao is a problem. oxidized LDL is a problem, but it's a matter of what do we do to correct that problem? And I'll go back to it again the 100 year Hart method eat well live well think well in depth testing, you know, and then evidence based supplements biohacking strategies, but the problem is not the TMO itself. It's whatever's causing you to do it's not from free range grass fed meats, not from wild salmon. Again, the vegan community jumped on that propaganda and it's all just a bunch of BS, I don't really even test tml levels, I don't really find it useful. I like to look for lipid peroxides in the urine. It's a very simple at home test that people can do without a doctor's prescription. We sell it on our website and includes a review with one of our health coaches. So because if you have inflammation oxidative stress, you're in trouble, you better figure out why that test is so much more important than lipids the total cholesterol is a worthless marker. The best lipid marker that we know of is actually a ratio called APR, B APR a ratio. The lower the better on that ratio is good. The lower the triglycerides, the better but it's never a situation for statin drugs. It's always about figuring out why homocysteine great marker, intracellular vitamins and minerals, intracellular co q 10, omega threes fatty acid, you know, profile breakdowns, but I'll tell you guys right now my outside of looking at inflammation as far as why people have these abnormalities. Look at the toxins just looking at a toxin panel. You can look for mold, mycotoxins other environmental toxins like pesticides that lates parabens PVCs VOCs plastics. It's this this recent study that came out right so that showed that when people were going for carotid endarterectomy surgery, so they clear the gunk out of the carotid artery on these people. And they broke their groups down into two they broke the people down into two groups. Half the group tested actually two thirds and had high levels of plastic in their carotid plaque. 1/3 of the group had no evidence of microplastics in the carotid endarterectomy plaque. So they followed them over three years, the group with the plastic versus those without had three times the risk of heart attack and stroke and dying in that three year period. So plastic therefore becomes a higher risk factor than tobacco, diabetes, you know, blood pressure, anything from plastic, what are your plastic levels? How do you know? Well, you can check a urine test for this phenol a and that's a great test as well. So

Dr. Terry Weyman:

that's fantastic. You also mentioned earlier, which is a organic substance I actually like, and that's meth blue. And, and there's been a lot of talk on nitric oxide, both in training, you'll see a lot of trainers and bodybuilders, you know, talking about nitrous oxide and, and some people talk as a good thing some people talk is a bad thing, especially when it comes to vascular health. And there's also something that a lot of people don't realize that, you know, those little blue pills that men take are filled with nitrous oxide. And so what's your views on this, this new exercise recommendation for a treatment plan? Let's talk a little bit about how meth blue is a good counteract for for nitrous oxide, when to use it and all that.

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Yeah, so lots of great parts of that right there. Let me just start with this like little story. So I was an internal medicine resident when the little blue pill Viagra came out in the late 1990s. And we were in the residence lounge, and we would sit on our break time and just talking, you know, you know, all the other residents and stuff like that, well, one of the Pfizer reps, the maker, of course of Viagra comes in, and he's sitting down, I'm sitting there with some of my buddies and the Pfizer rep, he just throws out hundreds of pills, and says, Guys, try this, have fun with this, you're gonna love it, your patients are gonna love it. Like that's what happened. And it was actually very successful. And I'm not down on the use of that pharmaceutical. Now I'd personally like to tell people, Hey, eat well live, well think well optimize all these other things. And then if you still need the blue pill, then you could take the blue pill, or, you know, in the in the longevity, anti aging world, the Cialis and the Viagra is very popular in there as far as an anti aging strategy and what it can do to increase perfusion and things like that. But that's just not something that I get into to use with people. You know, again, I think if people want to use it for you know, for occasional use for sexual intercourse, I'm fine with that. There are some medical indications to use it people with pulmonary hypertension. Now if I ever was interesting, it was interesting that it was actually invented as a blood pressure and anti and gentle and then once they started looking at this and they gave it to you know, a 500 people and you know, and they're checking their blood pressure blood pressure dropped, and then all the men started checking off this little box, it said better erectile function. So Pfizer said Who cares about blood pressure and they came up with you know, with his Edie drug. So that's the story on the use of those nitric oxide is very beneficial nitric oxide like everything, the best source is going to be free range grass fed meats and wild seafood eggs. Daily, if you do dairy, make sure you do it raw. That's going to be a great store source. Another one is green leafy vegetables, but also beets. So you'll see a lot of products of course that are beet root powder derivatives, of course, make sure everything's organic, to boost up nitric oxide, and in the healthy person who's eating while living while thinking while nitric oxide support is not going to cause any harm. There is some concern that nitric oxide boosters at high levels can turn into what's called a peroxy nitrates and peroxy nitrite that can be problematic. But again, those are markers of oxidative stress that you can you know easily check for and I don't think you know too much beetroot powder is causing people problems in that arena. I don't think there's really much to that issue of too much nitric oxide. We make Daedric oxide from proteins we make nitric oxide again from those food based nitrates. There's actually a and then the sun of course, you know downward Spencer's at getting out in the sun. Our skin is a solar panel. Everybody needs to remember that the skin is the solar panel. The eyeballs are a solar panel built to collect light one of the things the skin does it turns the sun turns stored nitrates into nitric oxide. If you get a sunburn once a sunburn the area becomes very red you push on it becomes white you release it becomes red again, that's all hyperemia tremendous blood flow from nitric oxide in the capillaries of the skin. It's all beneficial. Sunburn is bad. I'm not saying get sunburn, sunburn bad but sunshine, good smart sunshine is really the key there. And then to wrap up this thing here with methylene, blue methylene blue, there's not a lot of data on it. Okay, so I'm not going to sit here and proselytize about methylene blue too much very interesting about its ability as an antioxidant and supporter of the electron transport chain and cellular energy and the making of cellular water. At the end of the day, it is a synthetic blue textile, you know, from from the from the textile industry. It is a synthetic chemical. So, the jury's still out, I would use methylene blue not as a biohacking strategy or how to improve athletic performance, although somebody could try it. And if someone says, Okay, well I run a 10.5 meter, you know, 10.5 second 100 meter dash, and that's what I always do and all my math blue and I'm running 10.3 Okay, cool. That'll be up to you. I'm not aware of any downside to it. But for people with a lot more severe cardiovascular disease, a lot of Parkinson's, dementia, when you're kind of pulling out the kitchen sink. I think part of the kitchen sink is not blue.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Love it. So let's take some of the overrated and underrated supplements like omega threes or CO q 10. Magnesium. Your thoughts on some of those? Are they overrated? Underrated? How do you feel about Spencer doobie?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

You're coming in a little bit quiet if you would. I'm sorry.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Omega threes co q 10. Magnesium, overrated? Underrated? What are your thoughts on some of those?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Okay, so, so Food First, we always want food first. So I'm not a big fan of Omega three fish oil. And I think some of the more recent data is starting to support that there's some concerns that omega three fish oil increases the risk of atrial fibrillation and so while that debates going on and we can you know, kind of come up with well who did the studies who did the research is it all biased against it? Let's just say just eat the fish eat the wild salmon, the sardines, anchovies, eat the eat the shellfish, clams, oysters, shrimp, lobster, crab scallops, those are all very high in natural omega threes. And they're wonderful foods. Like I said before people eat the most amount of seafood, lowest risk of everything. Now when you eat oysters, there's there's zinc, there's selenium, there are many other vitamins, everything that a clam needs to live and oyster needs to live as the salmon needs to live. It's all right there salmon roe, another super, super, super food, love those. And then you know, bison, liver bison hearts. Bison is a tremendous animal. And we have a product called kickstart my heart, which is bison heart bison liver, their field harvested bison, meaning that they're shot from a distance. And these are unvaccinated bison, which is pretty cool. So So those things that now Can someone take supplemental magnesium. Yeah, most certainly. You firstly, you can do magnesium salt baths, Epsom salt baths. You can take magnesium supplements, avocados are a great source of in the plant world of many things, including magnesium. But I think you know, but ultimately, you know, Spencer, let's do this. Let's test don't guess what are your intracellular levels of magnesium? Because maybe it's not a magnesium problem. Maybe it's a molybdenum problem. Maybe? You know, it is a problem. Yeah, with CO q 10. Now the best source of CO Q 10 is animal hearts, right? I mean, you know, animal tissue, humans need co Q 10 Shoto. Animals. If we eat the animals, we get the CO q 10. You don't get Coco co q 10. If I'm eating broccoli, so that's the strategy on how to do that. But yeah, like magnesium supplementation. I mean, it's, you know, hundreds of different bodily functions. I mean, sometimes, this is where this supplements supplement the healthy lifestyle and you can dial that in with the testing.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

That's fantastic. You know, I gotta I gotta tell you the I wasn't gonna bring this up. But I was born with a bicuspid aortic valve and I accidentally found that out because I was drinking too much coffee about 30 years ago, and then they did you know, the whole ultrasound and EKG and everything telemetry. And he said, Just keep an eye on it. And with all the heavy weight training, the lumen the aorta, starting to expand but anyway, now 27 years later, I'm you know, and I get checked every once in a while, this, this mitral valve, or excuse me, this aortic valve looks shredded and I'm starting to have some symptoms. My mother is going to kill me because she doesn't know about a lot of these things that I'm going to mention.

Unknown:

But boy, yeah,

Dr. Spencer Baron:

so anyway, you know, in testimony to the way you approach things. Every top rated, I interviewed cardiovascular surgeons, cardiac, cardiothoracic surgeons, I interviewed and I asked them, are you going to crack my chest open and you know, wire it shut with that barbaric looking wire hanger and all that stuff. And I mean, we're talking Cleveland Clinic, we're talking Baptist Hospital. Anyway, long story short, I would walk out gone, you gotta be kidding me. I have a buddy of mine, who came up to me and told me that he interviewed six cardiothoracic surgeons with the same condition he has which only 3% of the male population have bicuspid born with bicuspid aortic though anyway, he goes, I got a guy for it. I got well I I've been researching, I found a guy. And he's in University of Miami. He goes, that's the guy Joseph lamellas. Anyway, Dr. lamellas, did to two holes right here and did major seven and a half hour aortic valve replacement and aorta and put the dacron shield, you know, drill the holes, whatever and reattach the coronary. I was back to work. In one week. I ran a half marathon at 11 months. Now, my point in really telling you this is that you are a rock star specimen of someone who's who thinks for themselves and that people need to really understand that the majority of of medically trained osteopathic highly trained doctors are taught things from like the 1960s open heart surgery was was a 1960 product protocol. And and to never stop looking in the right direction for someone like yourself to do that kind of, you know, to approach listen,

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

I certainly think there is a time and a place for you know, heroic procedures. If you're a face if you're in the middle of a heart attack, you go to the hospital, you get an angiogram angioplasty and stent. Just like you Dr. Spencer, there's a time and a place for surgery, cardiovascular surgery, and you know, valvular heart disease, you know, certainly would be one of those indications. Sometimes somebody you know, just as intractable angina. Despite, you know, you know, all the things that we're doing, and they need coronary artery bypass surgery, there's a particular situation called left main coronary artery disease, where the main artery going into the heart is, is highly blocked, even though the person is not having symptoms that person appears to get, I would even send that person for surgery. So there is a time and a place for surgery. And to your point, the surgical techniques get better and better. I'm very familiar with Dr. Millis, you know, down there and the work that he does, and I've had people ask me about him, of note, I did one month of ICU work at Baptist Hospital in Kendall, way back in the day, and I also did an infectious disease at Jackson Memorial, and interviewed at Mount Sinai because before I moved out to Arizona from Chicago, I was I could have gone either way very happily, South Florida is a beautiful place to live. That being said, You know what happened with you? So but let me say this. Can we take someone like you, someone with someone with bicuspid, aortic valve or any condition, let's make them the healthiest version of themselves before the surgery. So we can kick the can on the surgery down the road as far as possible? Number because the techniques and strategies and everybody gets better and better over time. But also, can we therefore if we're the healthiest version of ourselves, just like you get out of the hospital quick, less risk, less damage from radiation and from anesthesia, how do we recover better? How do we get back to work in a week, if that's what we want to do? And that's where we optimize whenever possible, you know, before I send people sometimes for atrial fibrillation, ablations to ablate to burn out the area of atrial fibrillation, sometimes it's necessary, but can we make that person that healthiest version of themselves so they get the best success and longevity because as you would imagine, you know, Spencer, if you're eating McDonald's cookies and cupcakes, smoking cigarettes, staying up late not getting the sun living in in a moldy home, you're not going to live long with the new valve. But if you do all these things proactively, now you've got a valve that Yeah, they'll give you some average and they go Yeah, you know, this valve will last you know, 10 to 15, you know, years or 20 years, but It'll last a lot longer on average when you do things right.

Dr. Terry Weyman:

All right, I got stuff done that you got people with high blood pressure right now and they may be in seafood, but they're eating it with a nice cream sauce. And, and they may be eating a nice scallop, but it's rolled in a really bad pasta, you know? So you got these people with high blood pressure and our society, let's be honest, they'd like to take the quick pill the quick shot, you know, they're not really will they'll work harder on their card, and they will their own body, you know, so. So you've got these all this information out there. You got plant based animal based paleo keto, vegan vegetarian, what are some of the thoughts you have to bust through some of this? Call it just chaos or this fog to to lower their blood pressure, and to find the right diet for them?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Well, there is a lot of debate in the diet world, that's for sure. When I was a cardiology fellow, I was at the American College of Cardiology meetings in Orlando, Florida in the year 2000. And there was a debate between the late Robert Atkins of the Atkins diet and then Dean Ornish, who was a low fat, got it. And so therefore, one's high fat ones low fat, and I walked out of there, and I was just enthralled by Atkins and all of his information on what he was talking about it made perfect sense. What I would say is that no matter what diet you follow, make it organic, get the chemicals out of your diet. That's number one. Let's all agree on that. That glyphosate, pesticides, artificial ingredients, artificial flavors, colors, sweeteners, let's get that out of our diets and focus on organic food. But according to all the anthropology and paleontology literature, according to the explorers from around the world, who are explored in the seven 1600s 1700s of native populations, Weston A price in the 1920s. Looking at modern native peoples who live as their ancestors did, in areas of the Amazon and Africa, they are hunter gatherers. That's all there is to it. They hunt, and they gather. Now the coolest thing is go watch a TV show like alone, or Naked and Afraid. Go watch those survival shows. People start looking for meats and seafood. Otherwise they're going to die. They're going to starve to death. No one's given them bags or oatmeal, or, you know, tofu burgers, and Beyond Meat burgers. And the people who start off as vegans on the show, they either quickly turn into hunters, or they quit the show. Wow. It's just it's so common sense. It's so common sense. But I do want to reiterate this again. The diet is only part of the story. What's more important in the story is sleep. Sleep is much more important than the food we put in our mouth. However we got here again the biblical story. First there was darkness then there was light, or evolutionary, you know, again, we evolved in this day and night light and darkness cycle, we have these circadian rhythms. And if we violate those we're in trouble. Doesn't matter what we eat. Number so sleep is number one. Sunshine is number two. The sun is the source of life, aside from God and I higher Spirituality there but the sun provides life to everything on planet Earth. And if you don't get your solar panels out in the sun, AKA your skin, in your eyes in the sun, you're going to die what happens to a flower or a plant if you take it inside all plants? All animals are outside in the sun. We're the only idiots who are sitting inside talking about Oh, should I be eating tofu? Should I be eating you know, grass fed meat should I be eating? You know what, you know more almonds and walnuts. You know, you know, go go out and look at nature. We you know go and see what goats eat lions eat what lions eat. You know, humans eat humans eat. We're hunter gatherers. We used to live outside, running around naked, you know, all day long. We got to sleep on time. And we were of course, you know, very physically active and we stay when we were, you know, not in the chemicals that we're in, of course and the EMF and all the different poisons around us. So it's much more in depth in the diet story, but, you know, like I said, humans have been eating meat and using fire for over a million years. Do not be afraid of quality, quality free range, grass fed meats, wild seafood, that's all that I eat.

Dr. Terry Weyman:

All right, so on that same note, you'll see like the blue zones, and you know what they eat, and they will have fat, they'll have beds, real lard, and they will have this and they are hunters and gatherers. The thing that I've read a lot in the Blue Zones, they will have, they can have a glass of wine every day. So let's talk alcohol because you hear alcohol is a big component to heart disease. So what's Enough is enough? Are we talking red wine? Are we talking hard? I call I know, the sugar of mixed drinks is bad. But you can have all that. So what's your thoughts on alcohol? And what's too much of what's not enough and you avoid it?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Yeah, so I grew up as a drinker. My father was a drinker, I became a drinker. There's no sob story about my father's drinking, except for he died at 63. So that's kind of a sob story. We used to actually we had my grandparents had a place in Hallandale, Florida. And we used to we had a 21 foot speed boat, we used to tool up and now on the intercoastal, we used to go to bootleggers and shooters and dirty and alleys and all these places all the time. So I'm very familiar with alcohol. It's just not healthy. It's just not healthy. If you do drink alcohol, it's got to be organic. It's got to be organic red wine, it's got to be organic. Really anything organic tequila, beer should be organic, or at least preferably gluten free. I think one or two drinks on a weekly basis, I think is okay, anything more than that, I think is a problem. So, yeah, it's you know, we do know that people who drink alcohol have a much higher risk of atrial fibrillation, that's clearly a problem. Again, like the healthy the healthy user bias could be like, Oh, well, you know, the person who has a couple, you know, glasses of red wine per day, that may be the person who is also more likely to eat better, they may also be the one who exercises more live a healthier lifestyle. So it's really hard to extrapolate that to say that there's health benefits. I think it's a brain toxin, it's a liver toxin. It's just not something that we necessarily need. And if you're like, I need a couple of drinks at the end of the day to unwind, I think what you need to do is figure out why you need to unwind and fix that. Don't try and cover it up with alcohol or any other you know, no Kotick or some other illegal drug.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Very good. I want to talk to you about AFib atrial fibrillation. Again, my mother doesn't know this, but she's certainly going to find out I I've been on this quest to do an eight minute mile and I did it and now you know, with my behavior patterns, of course, I had to break the eight minutes down to you know, 750 and then so I was on track to do seven minutes 45 second mile on the treadmill. And I long story short, I went into AFib and I've never had a I went into AFib and I'm looking at my chest this thing is pumping wildly. And I don't think Dr. Terry even knows about this because I didn't want to tell anybody except one or two people. And I walked around the gym for a half an hour trying to catch my breath going I need to call 911 I need to call 911 I went ahead and went back to my place and I called 911 and as I'm talking to them it starts to calm down I tell them okay, I'm good I'm starting to feel better I feel and they go well you're the The ambulance is already on its way actually they're walking up to your door I go No no no no I don't want to go to the hospital I'm it's Father's Day I don't need to go anyway, ends up they do an EKG they said that I was fine. Let's check troponin levels let's go to the hospital All right, whatever so I ended up going for the ride for for ambulance drivers and I'm talking with them freely having a nice conversation that'll come up in just a moment when I tell you what the ended up happening. So ends up I'm in the I'm in the hospital. They checked me in everything's fine. They got 12 leads they got the pulse oximeter on they got an IV N and I'm going I'm getting out of here now. I'm leaving that I'm fine I start peeling off everything and sticking them on the railing and I'm you're you're an asshole so anyway ends up they go sir Sir You know I have to sign the release to get out they go How are you getting home? I go I'm gonna jog home. What do you think? I'm taking an Uber I'll be fine. I ended up i i Don't push it that hard. But I do feel that I was having a fifth now. I don't know what I did, but I take about 32 vitamin supplements. And I added some additional things like magnesium, I, you know, some of the things that I'm sure that you would, you know, appreciate, you know, I think there was beat X extract blackcurrant, garlic, a few other things. Anyway, I've been back to my eight minute mile, and I feel absolutely nothing. Now, can you explain why I have zero like zero symptoms of afib. And I've been pushing it hard.

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Yeah, so AFib This is a very common heart rhythm as people get older. And it certainly is more common in people that are post surgical, you know, as well post open heart surgery of any way shape or form. And atrial fibrillation by the way, something that we saw very often after the COVID shot a lot of high blood pressure after COVID shot, which I know you didn't get. But the the exercise induced AFib is something that's well known. It is a situation where it's sympathetic, you know, high sympathetic tone that leads to afib. Some people it's a parasympathetic thing, they tend to get a fit when they're sleeping. So it's parasympathetic driven. And you can only tell by checking your history or, you know, doing some kind of monitoring on on individual people. So most doctors would say, Okay, well don't exercise to that extreme right God dispenser or take a beta blocker to lower down your heart rate. So that doesn't happen. But I would always look at it and say, what are the deficiencies? What are the excess of Dr. Spencer? And how would I know that by a good history, and by the blood urine at work? And that because you'd mentioned magnesium? What if it's not a magnesium problem? What if it's a low potassium problem, intracellular? What if it was omega three, what it was co q 10? What if it's B, one, B, two, B, three, B, five, b, six, B, nine B 12. What it could be something else, it could be something else. So that would be the strategy there to make sure that you're optimized. And that would be a great way to, to prevent. There are some supplements, you know, Berberine has some anti rhythmic capabilities to is actually was compared to the most famous AFib drug called amiodarone. And Berberine. Was, is equally as effective as as amiodarone is very impressive study. And I showed this to electrophysiologist. And they're blown away by that data, including the electrophysiologist. Who works for me at natural heart. Doctor, you mentioned coffee before I do want to talk about coffee real quick. Because I grew up a coffee drinker. My wife, right chiropractor, Oh, coffee is terrible for your adrenals and coffee causes leaky gut and all these things. And I'm like, Ah, I love coffee. She's like, well, if you're gonna drink coffee, it has to be organic. And you have to find one that is mold free as well. Like, okay, so I got a question. You know, Dave Asprey and bulletproof coffee, they made a big deal out of mold, free coffee, but his stuff was not organic. So I started consulting with a couple of coffee companies, because they were asking me to, because they knew I liked coffee, and they wanted me to talk professionally about coffee and cardiovascular health. And I was doing that for a while I said, You know what, there's such great data here. And so many people are told not to drink coffee, for cardiovascular reasons. And the literature says that coffee is heart healthy. Coffee lowers the risk of AFib coffee lowers the risk of heart attack and stroke and sudden cardiac death. And it's got benefits that are anti cancer and anti dementia, coffee drinkers live longer. So I said, I'm gonna start my own company, I'm going to find a coffee that is organic, tested, we tested it for glyphosate, of which it doesn't have any detectable levels. And we tested it for mold Mikoto for mold, and there's no mold that's detectable in there. So I started a brand called cardiology coffee. And I'm not like pushing people to drink coffee. But I'm here to say, if you have cardiovascular issues, and you like coffee, you should drink it. Now, Spencer, if someone says that, you know, if someone were to say, well, you know, every time I drink coffee, I go into a fifth, I would say, well, a, let's look for other things that could be influencing this in addition to the coffee and B, then don't drink coffee. But in general, the blanket statement should not be don't drink coffee, it should be coffee is heart healthy, and make sure you drink good stuff.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Beautiful. Awesome.

Dr. Terry Weyman:

I want to note on that when he talked about AFib What's your thoughts on the ablations?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

So there was a time that place for an ablation, but it's typically going to be for someone who's symptomatic and they have done everything eat well live well think well test don't guess evidence based supplements biohacking strategies. If they failed all that, and they're still symptomatic, then I would send them for an ablation. So if they say, Listen, Jack, I've done everything you told me to do. I'm taking all the supplements, I've tried everything, but I'm still going in and out of AFib or I still have afib. And I don't like it. It's ruining my life. Like it's ruining my sex life and ruining my exercise life like I want to know, okay, fine, they go for an ablation, but understands, understand this ablation has a high failure rate. It is also risky. So the long term success of I mean, really, you know, most of the studies, even at this present day, 50 to 60% AFib ablation is successful at one year. That means, I mean, about half the people fail, and within five years, I mean, forget about it, pretty much everybody's back to afib. So, it's not a long term strike. Now, why do doctors recommend it because they get paid for it. If you don't have any symptoms, I definitely would not go for an ablation. Again, if you have symptoms, and you've done everything else then there's a time and a place for AFib ablation.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Alright, we're gonna we're gonna end with some rapid fire questions that have almost nothing.

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

I thought that was rapid fire Terry sent me Spencer's address, so I can email him an invoice for these free consults

Dr. Terry Weyman:

he's got absolutely yeah, especially when he rambles forever. Yeah, absolutely deserves that.

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

No, that's good stuff. It's good stuff. Obviously, I love talking about these things. I love talking about health and wellness, and it's affecting everybody. And you know, and I think also, let me say this too, because if your mom is listening, yeah, I don't want her to feel like any blame towards this congenital heart disease as a cause. It's not just like some random mutation. Yeah, there could be familial linkage and stuff like that. But I think something happens in utero to that individual person. And that in utero are combinations of violations of eat well live well, thank well, so food toxins sleeps, you know, I mean, listen, if someone is pregnant, for example, and they are eating an unhealthy diet, and they live in New York City, and they don't get good sleep, they're definitely not getting good sun, they may not be getting good physical activity, they're loaded full of chemicals. You're more likely to have a child with congenital heart disease.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

It's just fat. Yeah, so. All right. So let me let me these are going to be rapid fire questions that will they're a little they're not clinical. So I'm going to give you the first one is what is your favorite way to de stress your heart?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Just getting outside, getting outside is always the best thing. Just what whatever kind of stress you're under, just get outside go for a walk, go for a hike, go for a bike ride, go for a jog, just sit outside in a chair and just soak up Mother Nature. That's number one.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Question question number two, you're in your opinion what excuse me what is your your your what fad or trend that you see goes on drives you the most nuts or crazy

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

you know and obviously there's a new diet that comes out every single day all these different fad diets that are out there I would just have to say that my biggest thing that I'm against is veganism. Wow

Dr. Spencer Baron:

fantastic. If you were to sing karaoke What is your go to song

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

that's a good one. That's a good one. I'm gonna go with Don't Stop Believin by journey a lot of them no, I got a lot of them. If you got me on the spot, that is my favorite song. So

Dr. Spencer Baron:

let me hit you over the last question. When you put your socks and shoes on do you do sock shoe stuff or sock sock? And then shoe shoe? Yeah, sock sock.

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Doesn't everybody who the hell Who the hell does sock shoe sock shoe? I knew there's always something there's always someone in the room, right. All right, I'm

Dr. Spencer Baron:

done. I'm done with the rapid fire Are you got anything else to wrap up? You

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

guys are awesome. I appreciate you having me on. That was that was a lot of fun, hopefully get we gave people a lot of good information. And sure. I

Dr. Terry Weyman:

do have one one more comment. And I want you to finish with this because there's so many misconceptions and controversial stuff, especially around the heart. And I've been hearing a lot of push for stents and bypass surgeries. You kind of covered it all but I want to leave the listener with the last thing on the ear. And so can you just tell people I think we're in a society this they want that quick fix, but I know that's not the right thing. But what's your your talk on stents bypass surgery and how do we end this show?

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Yeah, there's there is a time and a place but stents and bypass surgeries are for people with symptoms. So if you have angina, from significant coronary artery blockages, and you've done all the things eat while live, well think well, and test don't guess and all the things I've talked about, and you have not been successful in those areas, then you can go for stent or bypass surgery. stents do not prevent heart attacks. stents do not save lives. When put in electively, if you're having a heart attack, that's a different story. But if you have a disease, or you have angina, the stent can help the symptoms, but it does not prevent heart attacks does not prevent you dying. previous presidents like Lyndon Johnson, Dwight Eisenhower, those guys had angina every day of their lives. They were sucking down nitroglycerin tablets, like they were m&ms for a kid in in, you know, grammar school. Wow. And they lived and they lived a long time, you know, with those conditions. So I guess what I would say again, there's a time and a place. There's time and a place for medicine and modern medicine, if you will, but it's at the end of the game, not at the beginning.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Well, to wrap this up, I gotta tell you, Dr. Jack Wilson. As I said before, you're a rockstar in this profession. You know, I've often told people that you can go to five different cardiologist for high blood pressure, cholesterol, and you'll get five different ways of approaching things. Well, I'm going to make you number six, because you've probably the most effective approach to resolving these matters without going on medications and, you know, a fad diet or anything like that. So thank you so much for being a part of the show. I just we're goal is to help as many people as possible, understand that there's a different and better way.

Dr. Jack Wolfson:

I'm very appreciative of all you guys. So thank you so much for having me on. Thank you.

Dr. Terry Weyman:

Great, thank you, Doc. Appreciate you, man.

Dr. Spencer Baron:

Thank you for listening to today's episode of The cracking backs podcast. We hope you enjoyed it. Make sure you follow us on Instagram at cracking backs podcast. catch new episodes every Monday. See you next time.