The mental pain and struggles of being a rock star- Cris Hodges (front man for Grey Daze)

In this powerful episode of the Crackin’ Backs Podcast, we’re joined by Cris Hodges, the new frontman for Grey Daze, Chester Bennington's original band. Taking on the role of lead vocalist after the tragic passing of Chester Bennington is no small feat. Cris, who has a rich background as a session vocalist and a frontman for a Linkin Park tribute band, now faces the challenge of honoring Chester's legacy while bringing his unique voice and style to the band’s music.

Fresh off a world tour with Grey Daze, Cris opens up about the emotional journey of stepping into such a revered position. He shares his experiences on the road, the lessons learned from the stage, and the deep emotional and psychological challenges that come with performing songs that explore intense and dark themes. Cris also reflects on the significant impact Chester Bennington had on his life, sharing personal stories that continue to influence his performances.

Throughout the episode, Cris discusses the emotional toll that performing night after night takes on him and how he connects with the lyrics in a way that resonates deeply with both him and the audience. He also sheds light on the insights he's gained into mental health, especially after stepping into the role once held by someone who struggled so profoundly with mental pain. This episode is a compelling look into the life of a musician who is not only keeping Chester Bennington's spirit alive but also forging his own path in the world of rock music.

Whether you're a fan of Grey Daze, intrigued by the legacy of Chester Bennington, interested in the emotional challenges of performing or want to learn more about mental health, this episode is a must-listen.

Learn More: For more about Cris Hodges and Grey Daze, check out the band's latest updates on Grey Daze Official Website or follow them on Instagram.

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Join us as we talk to some of the greatest minds and discover some of the most incredible gems you can use to maintain a higher level of health. Crackin Backs Podcast

Transcript

Dr. Spencer Baron: 0:00

Welcome to the cracking backs podcast. Today's episode is a must listen. We're joined by Chris Hodges, who's taken on the incredible challenge of stepping into a role of front man for Chester bennington's original band gray days. How does he honor Chester's legacy while carving out his own path and what's the real story behind the painful performances we see on stage. Chris shares his emotional and psychological battles that come with the territory, his personal connection with Chester and the toll the performing gray days' dark, intense lyrics takes on him. This episode is raw, revealing, and you won't want to miss it.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 0:44

All right? Well, I'm actually especially and I both pumped on this one. We bring him back, an old buddy of ours, but since we last talked, this man is now the front man of a new band. Well, not new band, but he's new to him. He's now the front man of the new band. Gray days, and just get back from a world tour, and the guy is setting records and making records and doing incredible things. And you know, it's always fun to talk to a rock star. So Chris, welcome back, bud.

Cris Hodges: 1:12

That's quite the introduction. You might, I might not live up to that standard.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:18

Oh, you always, you always hit the ball out of the park every time we hook up. Man. So hey, for those that don't know what grade A's is, you know, it's Chester Bennington from Lincoln Park. That's his first band, and and I had the honor of kind of hanging with you and the band when you first, kind of tried a couple things out. And what an incredible group of men. But you stepped into shoes, big shoes of Chesterton, Billington and and how have you found this journey of balancing his legacy and bringing your own uniqueness to the band? And how's that working?

Cris Hodges: 1:54

Uh, great question. First of all, missed you guys, and I love you guys, and I'm happy to be back on. So thank you. Our interview from the last time was one of my favorites that I did just because of how I don't know deep we got, we just like, hit it off automatically. And so love you guys. And thank you for having me back on. Thanks, bud. So the great ace thing has been pretty interesting. So this came up. I guess this was after the last time I was on this podcast, but they had, they were getting a lot of offers on touring live, and as we all know, that was Chester bennington's pre Lincoln Park band. He started it with Sean Dowdell, the drummer, and that he ended up leaving gray days to go on to Lincoln Park, but they had recorded a bunch of songs together. And, you know, back in the 90s, and so, um, Lincoln Park had just, it was 2017 Lincoln Park had just put out one more light, and Chester was actually scheduled to go back and have a reunion with gray days, and tragically, we lost Chester in 2017 that actually happened two days before their first grade A's rehearsal was scheduled. So they lost that opportunity with Chester, but they had all of all of the vocals from previous recordings of these songs. And so what they ended up doing was taking Chester's voice and all the past vocals and repurposing the songs, redoing the songs with with head and monkey from corn, from Dave Navarro, Marcus Curel from pod. They just had a bunch of people come in as a celebration of life, and they re imagined these songs using Chester's original vocals, and that's how we got amends. We got the second record of the Phoenix, and then the stripped album. It was an acoustic album. And so they had this body of work that was getting a lot of interest, but obviously they can't tour. The band was signed to Loma VISTA and but they were getting a lot of offers. And so a few years went by from 2017 to 2022. Is when they hit me up. November of 2022, is when they hit me up. And they, you know, I knew Sean reasonably like enough. I knew him as a as a colleague in the music industry, and he called me up and he said, we're getting a lot of these offers. We have this festival in Arizona, called you fest. Do you want to come, like, perform at you fest with grade A's? And I was like, dude, first of all, yes, but the very first you're saying, the very first show that you want us to do is in front of 15,000 people. That's Chester's old band and that you guys haven't performed in 30 years. So is that what you're telling me? And he's like, yeah, so I got Okay, fine, fine. Like, why not? So the very first show that. We did was in front of 15,000 people at a festival with, you know, not replacing Chester, but singing, doing, doing Chester's position. And so that was nerve wracking. What made it more nerve wracking was we had a technological issue, and we lost, we lost our in ears, like we lost all sound. And so we were basically performing trying to listen to the PA at you fest, and just the sound bouncing off of you know, that's how we were trying to listen. And so I thought it was a disaster, man. I thought that I had just butchered the gray days legacy. I was on stage, and I was just like, the whole time, I was thinking, I'm gonna get blasted for this. This is my career's over. Like, this is done, but we got off stage, dude and like, it wasn't the best show in the world, but the fans that that have waited 30 years to hear this music. They didn't care, dude, they were just, they were just excited that this music was being performed live. And it was incredible to meet all these people and to get the stories of, you know, three generations, three three decades, of these fans and new fans coming in. And that's when we were like, Okay, we might have something here. Let's tour around with this product. We ended up going to the UK, to Europe, to Germany, and, dude, it's just a testament, again, of the music that they wrote and the legacy of Chester, and it's been, it's been an amazing, amazing ride, but it did not start out that way, man, that was not a good start.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 6:51

You know, a lot of the audience listening right now, when they go to a concert, they see it and and they get pumped, and they jumping around, they get excited. And, you know, like I said, I was at that one show with you, and I saw them just having a great time. What I don't think a lot of people really understand. That took me a while talking to you, hanging out with you, and talking to other musicians, is and being raised by a singer. In order to sell a song, you have to own the song. You have to feel the song, and you have to create a powerful performance. So the audience does feel what they feel, but that puts a lot of pressure on the singer as well as the band, and they see this power performance, but sometimes they don't see all the struggles behind it, you know, pre show, post show, and when you do it every night. So what do you wish more people understood about the emotional and the psychological challenges that musicians face.

Cris Hodges: 7:45

That's a solid question, because it be it's not about it's not about us anymore when we're on stage and we're performing for people, and this is what keeps me engaged for each and every show, it's not about us, it's about the people that have paid good money to come out, the people that have waited a very long time to see this, this product. And so I keep in mind that it's not about me, it's not about us, it's about the people that show up, and it's about the a lot of these people come for the cathartic. You know, Chester's legacy is, is, is just a roller coaster of emotion. And so this is very important, that we communicate that and we connect with people on that level. And so if we becomes more than just playing songs, it's more about connecting with the audience. And it doesn't matter what song we're playing like I want to connect with the audience, and I want to feel their emotions. I want to see their emotions. That's one of the things, Terry, you see me go down like in every show, almost every show, I'm out in the crowd, and I just I want to be close to these people. I want to feel them. I want to see them. And that's what keeps me going, regardless of how I'm feeling, if I'm sick, if I'm tired, it doesn't matter, because it's a once in a lifetime, especially with this project, it's a once in a lifetime opportunity for a lot of these people to experience it.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 9:14

We would like to thank Stark roast for making the best organic coffee and supporting our efforts to keep you healthy and happy. Click on the link to start enjoying your fresh roast today. Gosh, Chris, let me ask you. I mean, when we last spoke, when we last at the interview with you, you were an opening act for altar bridge, one of my favorite, one of my favorite bands at the time too. How did that go for it? How did you feel being on stage, you know, moving forward like

Cris Hodges: 9:49

that? Yeah, that was a cool that was a cool experience. The guys in Ultra bridge are amazing. And what's funny about that tour is you. Mark and all the guys are really down to earth, like they're just dudes. And so a lot of the times when, when we when Alter Bridge was on stage, miles, Kennedy has this section where he's just playing the acoustic guitar and the band walks off. And so I was always side stage, because I've always admired Alter Bridge, so I'm just watching every night, and then mark would just come up and sit next to me while Miles is playing the, you know, playing his acoustic set. And we just like, start talking. He was like, Mark's like, this is my favorite part of the show. I don't have to do anything. I just get to watch it. I was like, so we would just like, hang out and watch Miles' acoustic set. And that was the cool thing about those they were just Super Down to Earth, guys. And a lot of you know, opening acts get treated a little bit differently, in most cases, not not us, like we were treated like as equals, and we were taken care of. And that was a great that was a great experience, man.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 10:59

So now we fast forwarded, and now you're the killer lead guy now, and you're with a band that has tremendous credential. And you, you, you, you know, going back, you mentioned, you know, past interviews with Chester, you know he had some, some significant impact on your life. I mean, I listen to songs like B 12 and drag and all that. They're very they're deep and they're emotional, and you know, so can you share a moment or a story that particularly resonates with you and how it influenced the way you performed a song?

Cris Hodges: 11:30

Yeah, I think that one of the two most thought provoking and emotional songs that great ACE has is, first of all, Soul song. If you had a chance to listen to soul song, I would, I would greatly recommend it. But soul song is a highly, highly emotional song. So is Moray sky. And I think that the first time that I performed both of those live. I mean, I look down and there's just tears, there's just tears in people's eyes, because of how special these songs are to people. And I think the first time that we did Moray sky and soul song in a set, I think I realized at that point, the impact that this was having on people on a deeply emotional level, like I said, it's very cathartic for a lot of people. And then when you bust out a hit, like B 12, and then the mosh pit starts and, like, people just go crazy. It's like, Man, that is an emotional roller coaster. Dude, from people going crying to, like, elbowing people in the face, like it's, it's just, it's crazy. Dude, so you got to keep up with, you got to keep up with all these emotions, and you got to roll with it, because they're, they're experiencing it, man, on a on a deep level.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 13:00

Okay, so, oh, go ahead, Terry,

Dr. Terry Weyman: 13:02

I have one. All right, so you just mentioned that these, the audience is going through this on the deep level, right? And they just come to one show. You're doing that deep emotion, night after night after night after night. What's it like to be you?

Cris Hodges: 13:24

First of all, this is, this is not a thing that I take lightly. This can't be messed up. This is, this is very important. This is a very important part of my life is making sure that I do the songs justice to do it every night, first of all, is incredibly difficult because of the vocal patterns and parts. And you know, Chester was extremely dynamic with his vocals and his voice, and so doing it every night is a lot of fun. It's the lead up before that that takes a lot of work. Well, I have to I have to drink a gallon of water a day. I have to sleep as much as I possibly can. A lot of days I have to go on vocal rest, which means I don't say a word until I hit that stage to make sure that I save my voice for the actual performance. And so it takes a lot of work to lead up to that, to that 75 minutes, or that 90 minutes. But once you hit the stage, like everything, you forget everything, and you forget all the hard work. You forget you know, internal conflicts, and you forget all of that stuff. And all of a sudden, like I said before, it comes back to being with the audience, everybody being one, and so being in the moment, like forgetting everything and being in the moment on stage is probably my favorite. Don't tell my wife. My favorite thing about being alive is being on stage. In that moment, yeah,

Dr. Spencer Baron: 15:02

so, so let's go back to some deep, dark themes, like lyrics. And, you know, Moray sky has, you know, some very emotional, you know, points to it. And many years ago, you know, and I want to take another end of the spectrum. Here we were, you know, like rap music has, you know, talks about very decadent things, like, you know, police, you know, you know, killing people. And it said, you know, drugs and money and abusing women and everything. And our kids are repeating these lyrics because they The music's cool and I and you find themselves, you know, you're almost very, in a very stealth way, brainwashing. So going to, you know some of the lyrics in in Maury sky, and you have to live it and breathe it and feel it. How do you? How do you, how do you purge some of that, that stuff, what do you do? Personally,

Cris Hodges: 15:55

that's a great question. Man, that's a good question that goes so deep because we, last time we talked like we all, we all go through internal struggles and everything. I have deep, deep, dark valleys. Or if I, if I were to manifest, I would say I used to have deep and dark valleys, right? And the music is the some people say, What? What comes first? You know, the chicken or the egg. Does the music create depression? Or is this music a cathartic way to express the depression and get it out right? And so you can look at it two different ways. This has always been a really, this has been a point of argument, especially in United States media, with the likes of Marilyn Manson coming out and Slipknot coming out, and people calling it devil music and and people saying that it's creating a bad influence on people. Well, is it, is it, is it actually? Is it creating a bad influence, or is it allowing a channel for people to release their emotions so that they don't release it in another way? You know what I'm saying? Oh, yeah. And so I look at, I look at this music as the same way. Is it creating depression and anxiety for me? No. And I had to go in deep and realize that what, what more so it is, is it's a channel and a conduit to allow me to express a lot of things that me and Chester had in common. And I think that that is, I think that that is the reason why this project and Lincoln Park and all of these these bands that express themselves in this way. I think that that's the reason why they have the the platform that they have. It's not because it's inciting depression, anxiety, violence. I think it's be I think it's people releasing that in this manner so that they don't go release it in another way. Nice.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 18:00

Very nice, very nice, you know, I actually look at lyrics a lot more closely nowadays, you know, and see what I'm what I'm reciting, or what's, you know, going in my head. Lately, I've been listening to Black Label society.

Cris Hodges: 18:13

I love great band.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 18:14

I love Zach wild, that boy. They're Black Sabbath, like, you know, the old days, you know. So it really great. But each performance, obviously, can be a learning experience for you. What are some of the more significant lessons that you might have learned? You know, being on stage with grade A's

Cris Hodges: 18:31

the every every band has its own cadence and its own identity up on stage. And so when I was doing in the end, for example, we had been together for years, six or six or seven years in various projects before we started doing in the end. So we knew each other's we knew each other's style, we knew each other's motions on stage, where we stand, what we do, there's, there's parts of the show that become, and we don't even mean this to happen, but they become choreographed just because we're on stage so much, and we're like, Oh, we did this at this last show. It was kind of cool. And so jumping in with gray days was like, was like, just a new relationship and learning each other who we were off stage and who we were on stage, and, you know, learning each other's motions and learning how to interact with each other on stage. It was, it was an interesting experience, because, again, those guys hadn't played in quite some time, and so, you know, on stage. And so it was a new experience, I believe, for them, just being on stage, in that in that capacity, but for me to learn and understand and work with them and work. Uh, we actually ended up creating me and Kristen, the guitarist. We ended up creating. We just started doing this thing where we me and him will rate the show, like how the show is going in the middle of the show. And so we have, we have this like, sign language, if you ever watch if you ever watch us perform, we'll look at each other. We're like, four, five, where are we at two? And we'll start having this. We'll start having this, like, banter on stage in the middle of a song. And so that was one of the fun things that started happening, is like, at you fest, it was just like, Dude, we're not doing well. This is a one for sure. This is like, you know, in Europe, when it's when it's just clicking and everything is, is amazing. You know, we'd look over each other be like, this is solid eight. This is a solid nine, you know, I'm saying. And so the the relationship that you build off stage, but the relationship that you build on stage is very special to me, and it's a lot of fun. Y'all should come to the next show and watch a sign language like, see how you think we're doing. You know,

Dr. Terry Weyman: 21:10

great. You know, you just mentioned, you know, Europe and say it's a world tour, is a lot different than just, you know, hopping in a van and just driving around local stuff. And so how has this world tour with great ace impacted your personal growth, both as an artist and as an individual?

Cris Hodges: 21:32

I think that I realized how, how important the music was, or I first, I not first realized, but I think, I think the impact of going overseas and playing this music overseas, I think at that point I realized how impactful and important it was, because gray days has been and will always be very, very popular in Europe, In the UK, in Germany, in Portugal and Brazil and I don't think that I understood the impact until we went over there. And touring Europe is one of my favorite things to do. The UK one of my favorite things to do. I just feel like they appreciate music so much over there. And I, I think that we're definitely gonna, we are definitely going back. But I would venture to say this is one of my favorite like UK, Europe, Germany, we're gonna, we're gonna go to Portugal in March and go play the meal arena. These are just opportunities that don't really come often for people, and for me, I think it's, I think it's understanding that and respecting that. This is, it's kind of like winning the lottery. This is a very special thing that I get to go do it. I won't always have the means or the ability or the opportunities to do it, and just staying in the moment and appreciating this moment for what it is is really, really important for me.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 23:14

You know, culture is a big thing, and everybody likes, especially right now is everybody talks about the American culture, and they tend to put us down. But we all have a unique culture. But every country has a unique culture. How and music combined Can, can bound people together despite culture. But how do you use, I mean, Spencer viable lecture, you know, internationally. And we were like, well, humor, we can't use certain humor because geographic, how do you, how do you balance culture with performance when you're in these different places? Hmm,

Cris Hodges: 23:51

great question. You're, you're absolutely right. Um, I worked with, I worked with a team prior to, prior to 2022, the Russian invasion on the Ukraine. I was flying out to St Petersburg, Russia and working with a band out there that is super awesome. And they they have a way different sense of humor. A lot of the things that I thought were funny, they didn't think was funny. How, you know, in each culture has that different mentality of what's funny and what's not. The only thing I can do, I can only be myself. And I don't think that the Russian culture understood sarcasm. And I'm very sarcastic. I'm a very sarcastic person, and so like, I think that they took things a lot to literally, and that was something that I had to learn about. The Russian culture was okay. Maybe sarcasm isn't the great, greatest form of building friendships. But, dude, each. Culture does have their own different thing. Um, Europe, the the culture in Amsterdam was a lot of fun. We did a sold out show in just outside of Amsterdam, in a town called in today, I'm hoping I pronounced that properly, but there are very conservative people, which is so funny. It's so strange to me. They're such a conservative people, but they love metal and they love rock. And that was confusing. You go to you go to Glasgow, right? You go play metal in Glasgow, and you're likely to get killed if you go into the mosh pit, but you play this music in in Amsterdam, in the Netherlands, and they're very conservative. They just, they're just taking in the music and letting the music affect them on this level. And it's such a different vibe. And you got to catch that vibe. If you want to connect on stage, you got to catch that vibe real quick. And that's been a that's been an interesting part of my job with this and touring the great A's music in different cultures is is how to respond to the different ways that they celebrate this music.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 26:16

So not only do you have to adapt to culture, but you when you're traveling, you're going from hotel to hotel and playing the plane. You have to adapt physically as well. And then you're, you're playing some really deep music that you have to own. So you're, it's really stressing you mentally as well. And then you add on the cultural change, that's a lot that people don't realize, going, Well, shit. Last week he played in UK this week. He's playing the states totally two different venues and and they don't, they don't really give you the consideration of, well, he didn't, probably sleep. He he traveled. The food changed. He's eating different stuff. How do you balance all this physical, mental stress, especially on the road?

Cris Hodges: 26:58

I think it was Kobe Bryant that brought this up. He's It was either Kobe or Michael Jordan. God, don't quote me on that. I'm pretty sure it was Kobe. But he said, nobody cares. Nobody cares if you're sick. Nobody cares how much you've practiced or rehearsed or slept or didn't sleep or throwing up had the flu. Nobody cares. Nobody cares. They want to see the performance. You're there to have a performance. And so that has always stuck with me. Nobody cares. Nobody cares if I just flew in and I didn't get any sleep the night before. What they care about is the performance and the connection, and so that's always been an interesting that's always been an interesting insight for me, to just disregard all of that, like anything that I'm feeling if I sleep or I didn't sleep, if I'm sick, if I'm not sick, when I get sick, by the way, when I get sick, and when a vocalist gets sick, it could cancel a show immediately. Um, and, dude, there's nothing you can do about you can't restring of vocal cords. And so do you know how much pressure that is and how much that creates worry and concern and again, like that's so much to bear, and especially if you fly overseas and you got these sold out shows, if this thing isn't working, I don't know what I'm gonna do. That is an insane amount of pressure. It doesn't matter once I hit the stage, I gotta make something work. I got to make something come out of here. And so to go back to your question, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter how much I've put into this. Nobody cares. I just got to go out there and do my job. So

Dr. Terry Weyman: 28:58

what? What routines do you do to keep yourself good, besides meditation?

Cris Hodges: 29:04

Yeah, like I said before, it's a, it's a, it's a stringent routine. I'm actually super boring on tour. I'm not fun at all. I told that story last time about us going to Tijuana and, you know, get almost getting arrested and like and following the like, almost not getting paid, and having to jump in this promoter's car and forcing him to pay pay me that that is a one off. I'm not usually that person on tour. On Tour. I have to be in bed at a reasonable hour. I have to get a reasonable amount of sleep. I have to drink a gallon of water, which is two of these bad boys, and I have to go on vocal rest. A lot of days, people will be talking to me. I'm like, sorry, I can't I can't talk until I hit that stage, you know. And there's two parts to this. I'm an extreme introvert. I don't know what you guys if you got. You guys done the, not the Myers, Briggs test, but do you know if you're an extrovert or introvert? Do y'all know what that is?

Dr. Spencer Baron: 30:07

I'm an introvert, yeah. We're all introverts, yeah,

Cris Hodges: 30:10

which is funny, because we're all doing a podcast and yeah, right, hilarious. Yeah, yeah. David's an introvert as well, man, we would make for just a really boring dinner party, wouldn't we? Yep,

Dr. Terry Weyman: 30:25

we're all in bed by eight.

Cris Hodges: 30:29

And so it fits my it fits my original Personality, being able being on tour, not being able to talk and drink in a gallon water, having to sleep. That fits my original like my who I am, but I'm not like a lot of I think we're introverts. Don't make up a whole lot of the world. I think most people are extroverts, and so being around a bunch of extroverts when you're an introvert is very hard, but it's funny, because I get to use this as an excuse, like, sorry I can't talk right now, like I gotta be on vocal rest. And so I enjoy it. I enjoy this introspective, introvertedness that I have to be to perform a three week tour, but it is a lot of hard work to to remain in that when you're in an environment of rock and roll, and you know, it is, it's such a it's such a dichotomy. It's such a crazy, get on stage, be crazy, pump up the audience, and then go to bed. You know, it's like a crazy thing to process mentally.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 31:43

Hey, Chris, do you feel that you're the pinnacle of your career?

Cris Hodges: 31:49

I hope not. Yeah, I hope not. Again. Kobe Bryant or Michael Jordan, they had so many good quotes. No, it was. It was, uh, Tom Brady. Someone asked, Tom Brady, what's your what's your favorite Super Bowl that you won? And Tom Brady said, the next one, right? And so I always think of that in in career terms, what is your favorite moment of your career? And I say the next one because I don't want to think of hitting a pinnacle. The gatekeepers are gone. There's no rules anymore. You You can do anything you want to do. You can be anything you want to be. And so I don't, I don't think that this is the pinnacle of my career. I hope it's not. I will manifest that it's not. And so the next, the next, the next peak, is my favorite peak. Let's say that that's great.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 32:49

That's great. So you started to allude before allude to, you know, getting a feel for the audience. And have you kind of mastered that, that sensitivity, or that empathy for the audience and playing to it, you know, depending on what country you're in, or or city, or what have you. Because obviously, like, you know, like stand up comedians, they have to get a feel for, you know, they have a shtick, but they have to get a feel for, are they going to handle that or not? Maybe I should modify it. How do you? How do you go about with that? So

Cris Hodges: 33:23

luckily, great question. I started out in the industry. I moved from Dallas, Texas to Los Angeles as a session vocalist. And what that means is my job when I got when I moved out to LA My job was to write music for other people, perform the music in their genres and and basically be the front man for their project. And that allowed me to, or it taught me, rather, to have a bunch of versatility, a lot of versatility. It put me in front of a lot of crowds that I would never be in front of. And to give you an example, one of the first crowds that I was in front of, I was hired to do a project, and the project had a few live performances, and one of them, one of the live performances, was at the House of Blues in Anaheim, in front of steel Panthers crowd. If you know about steel Panthers crowd, you know Steel Panther oh yeah, oh yeah. And this is, this is, this is a wild and crazy crowd. Have you ever seen their shows? It's hilarious. It's they're so funny. They're funny, but their their audience is is unrelenting, if they don't like something unrelenting. And this was my first performance in front of 2000 people. As my first big performance in front of 2000 people was opening up for Steel Panther and. This is at the time I had, I had limited stage time, and I remember being backstage, like, just frozen, like, holy shit, this is not gonna go well. And I went out and I performed, and I, you know, you don't know your identity at that stage. You don't know who you are on stage. And I remember performing, I think we were like, two or three songs in, and someone from the crowd shouted out, you're trying too hard. And I was like, Damn, he caught me. Um, and I at that moment, I had, I hit a crossroads in that moment, I could I could cower. I could be like, damn it, I'm not doing a great job. Or I could try to win them over. I could try to win them over in whatever form or fashion I can. And so I made it my life's mission for the next next 30 minutes to win over the crowd of Steel Panther and by God, I think I did it because at the end I was, I was again off stage, and I had everyone, everyone was raising their hands high five and having a good time, like being a part of the experience. But I had to realize I wasn't. I was trying to be somebody that I wasn't, and somebody called me out on it. Unfortunately, I was on stage in front of 2000 people, but I wasn't being my true, genuine, authentic self. Someone called me out on it, and I said, I got nothing to lose at this point. I'm just going to be myself and and hopefully win you all over. And I think that we did, and I've always taken that lesson with me throughout all the projects that I've done and all the cultures that I go to, is I need to make sure that I'm not trying too hard. I need to make sure that I'm being my authentic self, but my goal is to win you over every single show, every single culture, every single country.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 37:08

All right, Chris, I got we've been I gotta ask this question, because it's kind of burning inside of me, and I'm gonna take you a little deep. So I hope you're okay with that. Let's go deep, buddy. All right, you stepped into Chester's band, right? And so when now that you're part of Chester's original culture, have you seen the insight why he commit he took his life, and have you seen where he went with that? And how are you surviving it being in his place, who?

Cris Hodges: 37:43

Buddy, that's, that's a, that's a very, very, very good question. Um, I have met so many of Chester's friends and family, and I've heard so many fun stories about Chester and a lot of darkness that came with his upbringing and where he was even leading up to the days of his his suicide. And if you watch any of the interviews, you He wasn't like he was. You wouldn't have expected it, but he gave signs. He he would, he would let people in. He and let people know. Hey, you know, this is a dark place. This is a place that I don't want to I don't need to hang out by myself, and so that was there, and talking with a lot of his friends and his family, I can say that Being in those places that he was, I can understand, I can understand why he did what he did. It is a dark, dark place that most people don't realize. And when you add a couple just a couple of external variables, it's already a hard place to live if you struggle with depression and anxiety, it's this, it's this just torment. It's an unseen torment that nobody can that nobody can feel. And it's like you're drowning and you're looking around and you're like, can't you see or feel what I'm feeling? And of course, people can't, because they're not inside your head. And so you add a couple of external variables to the already struggling person. And yeah, man, like you just want people don't want to die. I think that people just want to escape the torment. Is it's like, it's like being it's like being tortured on a daily basis. You're being tortured, and it's an unseen torture, and you don't want to die. You just want the pain to end. And so when you look at, when you look at not just Chester, but almost everybody that has taken their lives, they just want the pain to end. And so when you think of it on that level, it becomes a question of like, how do you help people end the pain? Or, how do you what can we do to help people see or feel something differently. And I think that's the question that we need to be asking all these mental health nonprofits and people that are friends with, people that know that they're struggling. You know that you know you have a friend that's struggling with depression and anxiety. It becomes that question is, I know you're going through pain that I can't see. I know you're struggling with this. I know it's it feels like someone is torturing you. And so the answer, or the the way that we the way that we engage with that is, how can I lessen the pain? How can I make help, make the pain go away? And I think that's the question we have to start asking, is, how can we help people take the pain away, instead of just keeping them alive, keeping them alive, okay, but they're still in pain? Well, how do we take how do we help take the pain away?

Dr. Terry Weyman: 41:37

I think that's a million dollar question. I mean, you even look at Robin Williams, nobody knew, you know, it's like, you know, the same type of thing. And so when you sing the songs that he was singing, obviously you talked earlier about, it's a way of getting it out. You know, obviously, maybe he wasn't able to get it out as much are you finding? Have you put any have you learned from that, have you put in a twist to help you get it out, to help other people get it out?

Cris Hodges: 42:05

Yes, and Russell Brand was talking about this at one point, he goes, he said something along the lines of, do you know how much I have to do to just be okay? And I thought that that was a brilliant like, if you look at all of the things that you know, I know that cracking backs is, is very much physically driven. You know, getting the body in shape is, is a third of it. I'm convinced that's a third of it. And doing chiropractic work, working out, eating healthy, sleeping, drinking water, all of that is a very important aspect of the of the whole and that's all the things that I have to do to be okay. I also have to meditate to be okay. I also have to go to healers to be okay. I also have to cold, cold plunges and and these deep, like even you look at the research on psilocybin in result in effect that has that such, such a positive effect on mental health. Look a look at Harvard and in UCLA go. Look at these studies that they're doing on psilocybin as a means of relieving depression and anxiety. Like these are all very, very important factors to a human that struggles with depression and anxiety to be okay. And so the amount of the amount of things that I have to do to just be okay is insane. It's a full time job to just be okay. But once you like, when you have those moments of all of the darkness being melted off of you and you, you have all of it aligned. Taoism and Buddhism talks about chakras, and having your chakras aligned however you want to, however you want to translate that to your own beliefs. You have to be aligned in some form or fashion. If it's chakras, if it's Christians, use the Holy Trinity, however you want to describe that mind, body, spirit, however you want to translate that to your upbringing and your culture. It's super important that you practice it, because there is an alignment that needs to happen. You're you aren't just your body, your your energy. You're a mind, you're a spirit. Some people believe, I believe, and so all of these things have to come into play for you to be okay, especially if you deal with depression and anxiety. I don't know if that answered your question. I think I just went off on a tangent. No,

Dr. Spencer Baron: 44:57

that's great. That's great. Yeah, we. We were gonna, you know, I wanted to ask you, what are those things that you do, that you answered that very, very efficiently, is there, like, a big thing that you started doing that that maybe even now, that you find really helps you pivot from, you know, when you feel like you're on the edge, and then moves you off into some into a better place? Sure,

Cris Hodges: 45:22

I I went through, and Terry knows about this, I went through probably one of the darkest, darkest periods of my life in 2023 early 2023 and I, honestly, I didn't know if I was gonna make it out I was at that point. I don't think that I have ever feared for my life as much as I did in 2023 and it was a it was a moment where I had to enlist a lot more help than I have ever enlisted in my life, therapists, healers, prayers. I just, I just needed so much, so much to be okay. And in this process of of of searching and looking and manifesting solutions. I came across a person who didn't use psilocybin for recreational purposes. They used psilocybin for depression, anxiety, PTSD, and they were very knowledgeable on this. And I'm not a person that has ever really done drugs. Drugs weren't my thing. Alcohol has always been my thing, and I was, I was in AA, whenever I was younger, so I didn't handle alcohol very well, but drugs were something that I just wasn't into. But when someone introduced to me the the effects of psilocybin in terms of mental health, I was like, Look, I'm I'm honestly on the edge, and I don't know, I don't know if I'm going to be here next week. So if you can guide me through this process and and show me how, teach me how this works, and he did, and I will tell you that using psilocybin in a safe and effective manner for mental health and for depression and anxiety saved my life. It saved my life. It resets your brain, your brain waves and your neuro whatever's like it. It's a reset button if you use it in the right manner for the situations that you're in. And so it helped me to reset my brain in a time where my brain was killing me, it was killing me, and there was nothing I could do about it. I was drowning guys like I had never been in such a situation where I couldn't control my mind, and if you can't control your mind, you're not going to be able to control your actions. And so I was getting to the place where I wasn't able to control my mind anymore, and I needed something to help me, to save me. And so I will say that along with meditation, physical exercise, sleep, water, taking care of all the chakras, or the trinities, or however you want to describe it, making sure that I was taking care of everything else, I implemented a practice of every of safe and effective psilocybin to to help me regain myself. And it's something that honestly, guys, this is going to be the next breakthrough in in mental health, depression, anxiety, PTSD, this is going to be the next thing. Studies are coming out saying that it has better effects and more immediate effects than than depression medication with without the side effects that medication, surprisingly, I don't know why and how anybody comes up with this. Depression medication comes with a warning, and it says you may kill yourself. What are you talking about? What are you talking about, like this, this medication, this medication that's supposed to keep you from killing yourself, it may kill you. Like, what are you talking about in psilocybin doesn't come with that the psilocybin like, there are no studies, none anybody dying on psilocybin. It's like you're you can have a bad trip if you're not in the right place, but, but in terms of mental health, I don't see any. All the, all the studies that I see are positive, and then my personal experience saved my life. Well.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 50:00

Had a couple guests that were military veterans, first responders, more than one or two that have said that that has saved them. We actually had interviewed a guy who had a gun to in his mouth, pulled the trigger, and nothing happened, because his his one of his other firefighters knew that he was spiraling out of control and and broke into his car and emptied his gun so he had a second chance in life. And he he got, he found psilocybin to make it make, not only a huge difference, but he started a nonprofit to help other veterans and first responders do the same thing. So you're not alone, man. I mean, I know people that are micro dosing and are having a tremendous experience and and they're, I'm talking to them, and they're not tripping, they're not, you know, they're just feeling good,

Cris Hodges: 50:53

yeah, and that's, that's the cool thing about, you know, micro dosing is you're not getting high with micro dosing. You're living your life. It's, it's, you're not having any psychoactive effects on that level, I will say that you you can, you can go deeper, if you need to go deeper. Have you guys heard of ayahuasca? Like, that's a thing that people that's, that's a thing that people will come out like, there's been some, there's been some reports of bad trips and everything like that. But people are coming out healed of alcoholism and all these things. I think that we need to start, you know, you go back, you have this discussion about what we can do, what we can do in the mental health space, and understand the first, the first thing is definitely understanding that people are that people are being tortured. Like, if you can, if you can imagine it some way. It's, it's torture, so understanding that people do go through that is the first, is the first stage. But also let's, let's drop our our prejudices and our dogmas about what is actually helping and what doesn't help. And let's start looking outside of the box, so to speak on, on what's actually healing people. And let's look at studies. Let's look at studies I don't want to hear about. For to me, it's mind blowing that alcohol is completely legal, but something like psilocybin currently is not in all 50 states. Blows my mind. Blows my mind.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 52:21

Yeah. You know it. What worries me is that the pharmaceutical company will get involved in one of two ways. They'll start manufacturing and processing, you know, mushrooms into, you know, psilocybin, or the effects of that. So that's unfortunate. And then the other thing is that what they may do is publish studies sometimes embellished or fake of the problems that would occur from, you know, microdosing or psilocybin, you know, like this could cause suicide.

Cris Hodges: 52:57

Um, sure, and I, and I would, I would encourage. I mean, I love other perspectives. Other perspectives is how people come to conclusions. A lot of people say, Well, I hate Fox, or I hate CNN, or I hate MSNBC. You know, this is where I get my news, or that's where I get my news. I'm just like, Why? Why get your news from one source? Why don't you get your news from all sources and make your own, make up your own damn mind. And so I encourage, I encourage the the the conflict and the the alternative opinions of of any medicines or any anything like that, if somebody, if somebody came out tomorrow and said, you know, oh, well, actually, psilocybin has killed this many people. First of all, I'm gonna go look it up, and I'm gonna go find the like, make sure that that's true. Like, cite your source. We were taught that in high school, cite your source, and if it comes out to be true, then great, I'm glad that it came out and but you're you're right. There's gonna be people against it that aren't making money off of it, like the pharmaceutical industry, they're currently not making money off of it. It's a threat to their business. So either they are going to get into it or they are going to try to dispel it. And so if they try to dispel it, then great, cite your source. You know what I'm saying. If you try to get into it, then make sure you don't fuck it up like you did the other, the the other medical grade pharmaceuticals that you've created, create a product that says, you know, here, here, you take this to don't kill yourself, and then you it may kill it may kill you, but, but, you know, don't, don't do that. Don't be shady. Come on.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 54:39

It's scary, you know, it's funny. That's why I subscribed to New York Times and Wall Street Journal, and they're sometimes completely opposing points of view, and sometimes Wall Street Journal makes fun of the author of an article that was that came out. And so it balances everything. But even then, it's hard to determine what's truth versus what's fun. Calls. I got it totally Chris, yeah, I got a question regarding many years ago, I was talking to one of the psychologists at Miami Dolphins, and he said, I asked him, What is Depression? How does somebody go into depression? And he goes, Well, it's not like they wake up one morning and they're depressed. He goes, it's usually a sequence of very little things that happen that make you go, what the fuck you know this? How did this happen in my life? How did I trip over the curb? How did I go to the store and it was closed? How did I come out to my car and forget my keys? You know, little things you know, do you Did you see that you know happening in your world? You know, as a slow manifestation of something bigger.

Cris Hodges: 55:43

I can tell you a few things, and I can only speak to my own, my own experiences with this. I I was born with it. I know that I can look back on my life and remember a heaviness that I couldn't explain because there aren't words. Whenever you're you know, you're 10 years old and you don't have the words to express what you're feeling. So I always knew I can look back and say there was something sitting on on me. And so just like people born with certain genetics, I think that you, you can be born with it, however, there are external variables that will accelerate it, or or or alleviate it. And being coming from the health and fitness industry like I did, I don't remember a time where I was most out of control than when I was most out of shape, when I was most out of shape and just completely like I didn't. I didn't have a workout routine, I didn't have a sleep routine. I was drinking a lot. I was eating poorly processed foods. I wasn't paying attention to any type of health and acupuncture, chiropractic work, anything that was, I think that was a time around 21 to 24 that, I mean, I, I wasn't, I didn't have the means to escape what I was going through at that point. And so, you know, you start off genetically. You start off with with having something on you, and then you add the external variables of like, you know, not taking care of yourself. It becomes this negative vortex. Well, the the not taking care of yourself is going to create the environment of depression. You already have depression, and so that's the spiral that you're in. You know it so it takes, it takes taking care of yourself, physically, emotionally and spiritually, to even be set up for the ability to escape that, that negative vortex, if you're, if you're just going after one aspect of it, like if you're just lifting weights, but you're not taking care of your spiritual or mental self, you're not, I mean, you're maybe a little bit, you have a little bit more of an opportunity to get, get out of it, but not much so for me again, going back to what I went through in 2023 I was taking care of myself, physically, mentally, spiritually, and then I found, I found this thing that could, that could help pull it all together. It's a spectrum, dude, I don't think that it's just like one thing that pulls you out of that. I think that there's circumstantial depression. I think that you can go through a lot, you can loot, you can have a lot of loss and and it will slip you into a depression. But again, it's like, what else are you doing? Do you have these other Do you have a support system? Are you regularly working on your physical self, your spiritual self, your mental self? Do you have the means to To combat this, this sadness? Are you setting yourself up for success, basically? And if the answer is no, then you have a less likely chance of getting out of it.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 59:22

There's a smart guy. I really, I just been through a lot of shit, man, yeah, well, there's something to be said about experience, you know. So I appreciate that we're gonna move on to our rapid fire questions before, yeah, there's five, there's five. You're the best man, all right. Chris, question number one, favorite song you ever sang,

Cris Hodges: 59:47

favorite song I ever sang was Ooh, favorite song I ever sang, I believe it has to be, it has to be a Lincoln Park Song. It's got to be one step. Closer, one step closer by Lincoln Park, dude, the energy playing that song live is insane. All right,

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:00:08

are you? Let me ask you one thing before we go. Number two, are you on vocal rest? Right now,

Cris Hodges: 1:00:13

I'm supposed to be. No, no, I'm on a I'm on a three week no, I'm on a three week break. I have two a four week break. I have two more weeks of this, so I have to go back on it here in about a week. But no, not right now.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:00:29

All right, so how about, how about the chorus of that song?

Cris Hodges: 1:00:32

Oh, dude, it's, it's 10am in the morning. What are you crazy? I haven't even warmed up. You want me to blow up my voice.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:00:41

Sorry. I'm just y'all, I'm just kidding. Come on, man,

Cris Hodges: 1:00:47

come on, Terry,

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:00:48

I'd sing it, but then you would never be my friend again. So he's had to ask, right?

Cris Hodges: 1:00:58

There's so much that's telling an athlete to go run a run a 40 without warming up. Good. One.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:01:04

Fair enough. Good. Fair enough.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 1:01:06

Very good. Oh my gosh. All right. Well, you know, Terry's questions could have been number two and number three, but they don't count. So here's number two. What's your favorite motorcycle ride? And don't say with Terry, definitely,

Cris Hodges: 1:01:23

Terry so slow, man, it's not even it's so like, wow, going on a motorcycle ride with Terry's like, going on a ride by yourself. He's, we're way back here. I don't know. Wait, wait,

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:01:39

wait, wait, who had to come up next to you to tell you you didn't, you didn't even know where the hell you were going.

Cris Hodges: 1:01:44

Hey, that's if I get lost. My honestly, one of my favorite rides is with Terry. Because Terry you took, you took us through, what did you take us through latigo Canyon? What was it, right? Yeah, um, but going on rides with Terry, he knows the wonderful spots. I think it was latigo, but aside from that, latigo, but aside from that, Angela's crest is one of the coolest and funnest rides. You started in LA, Canada, and you go through Angela's crest, it's super dangerous. You might fly off the cliff. You got to pay attention. But at the end of this ride, there's this restaurant called the grizzly, and it's this Podunk, like hole in the wall best burgers. It's my favorite ride to just go through Angela's crest and then hit the grizzly for burgers and fries.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:02:33

So I had this throw out that question, because, you know, weak this is, it's Sturgis week, so I had to throw out that question. Of

Cris Hodges: 1:02:40

course, I'll tell we haven't gone through Angela's crest together. We should do that. I love

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:02:44

that. That would be fun. As long as you wait for me and order me a burger.

Cris Hodges: 1:02:49

I'll be done. I'll be done with the burger by the time you show up. Dude,

Dr. Spencer Baron: 1:02:54

this is not question number three, but are there training wheels on Terry's motorcycles? They're worse. I had to

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:03:05

take him off. Yeah, I can't be seen with that bro, right? No, yeah, I had to put a jacket on him. He had to take the train wheels off me. Yeah,

Cris Hodges: 1:03:16

yeah. It says perfect. It's this perfect thing with me and Terry go out on a ride. His his training wheels got to be off, and my like, it's got to be hot for me to go out.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 1:03:28

All right, question number three, what's your favorite movie? And something that you can watch over and over again? I

Cris Hodges: 1:03:35

can watch any of the Batman movies over and over again. I'm a, I'm a, I'm obsessed with Batman. I think that that it's really dark, but Joker, the Joker with with Joaquin, Phoenix is one of my favorite movies, just because of how well done it is. Going back though, classics, Reservoir Dogs is one of my favorite if you want to go to like comedies, one of my favorite altar, I think it's a perfect, perfect comedy is the Wedding Crashers. I love Wedding Crashers as my comedy cult classic. And then if you want to go, if you want to go, like, weirdest, um, kind of like, cult classic. My favorite cult classic is office space.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 1:04:23

Oh, all right, all right, all right. Question number four,

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:04:27

wait, I guess which Batman? Since you like Batman, which Batman? Um,

Cris Hodges: 1:04:31

the dark night with Heath Ledger. The Dark Knight with Heath Ledger is one of my favorite, favorite movies. Didn't think that was asleep. We all slept on Heath Ledger until he showed up, popped on screen as the Joker, and then we were like, wow, that is that was a perfect performance. Perfect.

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:04:50

What after you like for Batman? Of all games, this

Cris Hodges: 1:04:53

is going to be very controversial, guys. All right. You ready for it? I like Ben Affleck. Do. Best as as he does the best Batman, he does the best Batman, I think the best. So the best Bruce Wayne, I think was probably, it was probably in the Tim Burton, you know, era. I think the Bruce Wayne, and then, you know, I think he's got it. I'm just gonna say all of them. By the end of the Yeah, I'm just gonna say all of them. But no, I think this very controversial, fight me if you want to fight me. But my favorite Batman is Ben Affleck.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 1:05:38

All right, moving along. Question number four, you love meditation. Where's your favorite place to meditate?

Cris Hodges: 1:05:44

Right here, buddy? I got a spot right here. I got my little I got my guitars, if you can see that, that's my little meditation spot. And then that is where I meditate, right there. Yo, yeah, it's, it's either that or I love going to taking my motorcycle out to Zuma Beach, out there by just north of Malibu, and finding a little spot right by the ocean. That's my next favorite spot to meditate. Can't, can't

Dr. Spencer Baron: 1:06:14

beat that. Can't beat that, absolutely. All right. Question number five, last one, while on the road. What is something you did for the first time? This

Cris Hodges: 1:06:25

last this last trip, sure that did for the first time. What did I do for the first time? Any Why would on any trip the first time we went on a cruise, and I I'd never been on a cruise before we performed on the cruise, and so that was an interesting cruise. Cruises are interesting because for introverts to perform on a cruise, so you don't just go and perform. This is something I didn't know. You don't just go and perform on stage, and then you're, you're off, and then your own you're, you're in your own little world. You're in front of everybody all the time. You got to go eat. You got to go to the buffet. You got to hang out. You know, anytime you step out of your room, it's just everybody. It's everybody. And so that was, like, a new experience for me, because I would get off stage, we do the thing, we hang out, and then, like, I go to the buffet, and everybody that just was at the show is now getting dinner at the buffet. They're like, and we're still taking pictures as I'm eating and we're signing, and I'm like, you know, eating my sausages and my my German food, and, and that was a new experience for me. Being performing on a cruise is like, you don't just perform that for that 90 minutes, and then you're off. You're like, you're in front of everybody, and on the entire time, which is, it's a trip for introverts to in front, in front and on all the time. Oh, beautiful,

Dr. Spencer Baron: 1:08:06

beautiful. All right, my man, that brings us to the end of the show. You are always fantastic, man, your energy. You know what? This, this, this whole podcast is like you were on stage. Thank you.

Cris Hodges: 1:08:19

I this is, this is, I love what you guys are doing. I remember when Terry came up with, you know, y'all came up with the idea of cracking backs, and I support you guys 100% I want to see sponsors come out. I want to see this be the next armchair expert. But you guys deserve it. You guys have insanely great questions, and I love you guys

Dr. Terry Weyman: 1:08:44

so much. It goes right back to you, buddy. I love you to death. So thank you so much for your time. Yeah, guys, awesome.

Dr. Spencer Baron: 1:08:56

Thank you for listening to today's episode of The cracking backs podcast. We hope you enjoyed it. Make sure you follow us on Instagram at cracking backs podcast, catch new episodes every Monday. See you next time you.